Copper foil lifting from edge of glass

Hi,
Could you give me any advice as to why my copper foil is lifting from the edge of my glass. When applying it the adhesive seems strong but the foil seems to lift when I put the iron on it to flat solder all of the edges prior to assembley. I then washed the glass parts befor assemblying the project and the foil lifted completely in parts. I don't know what I am doing wrong.
Sue

Answer

Make sure your glass is clean before you apply the foil. Before you foil the glass, wipe the edges with alcohol...you can get it at any pharmacy.

Burnish the foil very well. If it isn't burnished tightly to the glass, flux will get under the foil and cause it to lift.

There are very few instances where you need to "flat solder" the foiled pieces before assembly. In general copper foil work such as panels and suncatchers, tinning the foil before assembly is an unnecessary and time consuming step.

Washing the glass after the foil is applied is also not necessary. It is another place where liquid can get under the foil and cause it to lift.

Go to my Copper Foil Tutorial for more help. Make sure you read the pages on applying the foil and soldering.

Copper Foil Did Not Stick

by Susan
(Tryon, NC)

I had completely finished a project and was cleaning it up in order to put the patina on it. I washed it in warm water, then put flux remover on. One of the pieces just fell off. The foil did not stick. What did I do wrong?
Thanks, I really enjoy your site.
Susan

Answer

Hi Susan,

There could be several reasons for that happening:

1. The glass wasn't cleaned before you applied the foil.

2. The glass wasn't totally dry before you applied the foil.

3. You didn't burnish the foil well enough ... didn't get it tight against the glass.

4. The edge wasn't beaded up well enough.

5. When you washed the panel, you puled the foil loose by scrubbing from the center downward instead of the edge upward. Pushing against the foil, that way, will pull it loose quickly, especially if it hasn't been beaded well enough.

6. The edge wasn't reinforced with wire if there were irregular pieces that protruded from the panel. In that case, the protruding pieces can pull away from the panel due to their weight if they aren't properly reinforced.

As you might already know, the adhesive does not hold the panel together, but the foil must be burnished tightly against the dry, clean glass for it to stay in place. If the foil isn't burnished well, moisture can get between the glass and the foil causing pieces to fall off very soon.

Once the panel is soldered, the solder forms the framework that keeps the panel together. You are in essence making a psudo lead came when you build a bead of solder over the copper foil. You must form a well rounded bead everywhere, but especially around the edges, or finish the edges with lead or zinc. I finish my foiled pieces with a bead over wire, or just a bead, depending on the size of the piece.

You might want to look at my tutorial on Cleaning and Patina.

copper foil pulls loose

by olga koke
(virginia beach, va, 23462)

Hello, I have made a 7" by 7" panel and soldered jump rings to the top of the piece and on one side foil keeps on pulling off, is it better to solder rings to the sides of the panel instead of to the top?
Thank you

Answer

You need to solder the rings at a solder joint. If you solder the rings to an open area, as in your shell design, the foil will pull loose from the weight of the panel pulling down and the chains pulling up. There's nothing to anchor the jump rings to.

In the case of your panel, the only place you could put the jump rings so they are secure is where the shell touches the top. You could put two rings there, one on either side of the shell where the solder joints are. It's not the best placement on that panel, but the only place where they will be secure on top.

Yes, you can put them on the sides, but if you use one chain it will slide behind the panel and show through the glass. You could put 2 separate chains on the sides and hang the panel from 2 hooks.

Another alternative would be to solder a copper wire around the edges. Using one continuous piece, it would keep the foil in place and you could solder the jump rings wherever you want.

When you make a panel for hanging, you need to redesign a bit to integrate some cut lines that will join the edge where you will attach jump rings.

Foil not sticking

I am having difficulty with my foil sticking to the glass...I wash it, Windex it, wipe it down with alcohol and still sections just don't stick at all....many different rolls of foil so its not the foil or age of foil etc.. read about heating it in an electric frying pan...but please I can't sit around heating up pieces for 20 min. I need a realistic solution...any ideas...thanks Terry

Answer

Just stick with alcohol It will clean the edges better then water or Windex. However, I'm thinking that burnishing is the problem. You really need to burnish the foil until you're sure there isn't one single spot that isn't stuck down tight. It needs to be tight on the front, edge, and back. I use a small wooden wall paper roller, but there are roller tools available specifically for burnishing foil.

You didn't say whether it doesn't stick at all, or if it comes loose after washing the finished piece. If the piece isn't burnished extremely well, water and patina can seep under the smallest gap and cause the foil to loosen and lift off the glass.

Try wiping the glass with alcohol as you are foiling, not hours or minutes before. When I'm foiling I keep a cloth dampened with alcohol on my work bench. I pick up the glass, quickly wipe the edges with the alcohol cloth and apply the foil. For whatever reason, foil sticks better when the glass is freshly wiped with alcohol just prior to applying the foil.

Copper Foil Not Sticking After Soldering

by Sharon Harold
(South Africa)

After placing my copper foil and applying solder the copper foil doesn't seems to stick to my glass,I clean my glass before applying the foil, this only seems to happen after i have soldered it. I was wondering if maybe my soldering iron is to hot or maybe I am applying to much flux. Before applying the solder the copper foil sticks to the glass very well its only after applying the solder I have the problem,

Answer

It sounds like you don't burnish the foil well enough. If there is any place that isn't tight, flux will get under the foil and cause it to lift.

Working one area for too long will cause the foil to lift also. If you have an area that needs to be "fixed up", leave it until the solder is cool, then go back and do a bit more, leave it, and so on until you are satisfied with the results.

Thanks

Sharon Harold

Foil Lifting off Glass

While soldering my project the foil lifts off of the glass. Usually on the sides while the tops stays put - just the sides. what is going on?
Foil old or defective??
Iron too hot??
Just that type of glass?? - iridesent spectrum

Answer

Either your glass isn't clean or you haven't burnished the foil well enough.

Wipe the edges of your glass with alcohol. Just put some on a paper towel and run it along the edges. It only takes a few seconds to do. Then make sure you burnish the foil very well, by pressing down firmly on all three sides...front, back and edge. If the foil isn't burnished well enough, flux gets under it and causes the foil to lift.

Trouble with copper foil sticking to glass

by Linda
(Bradenton, FL)

I am having trouble with getting my copper foil to stick to the glass. And before you ask, I have ground the glass, cleaned it well and also wiped it with alcohol before applying the copper foil.

Answer

Try warming your glass before you apply the foil. You could lay the glass on a heating pad or in an electric frying pan turned on low.

Other than that, all I can think of is that you have a defective roll of foil. Try a different roll to see if that's the problem.

Lifing edges

by Mary
(Cypress)

I am working on some beveled angels. I have finished the normal steps copper foil, soldering, cleaning, patina and lastly putting on the wax. When removing the wax I noticed that some of the edges of soldered foil are lifting from the glass. What is happening?

Answer

Hi Mary,

This is a question that has been asked here many times. The main reason the foil lifts is two fold. Either the glass hasn't been cleaned to be free of grinder dust and fingerprints before the foil has been applied, or the foil hasn't been properly burnished after it has been applied.

If the foil isn't tight against the glass, flux or the water from cleaning will get under it and cause it to lift any time from during soldering to final polishing.

I use 90% isoporpyl alcohol to wipe the edges before I apply the foil. I use a very small wooden wall paper roller to burnish the foil. There are many other types of burnishers available. Any one will do as long as you take the time to make sure the foil is rubbed down tight.

Foil Not Sticking

by Teressa
(Lincoln City, Oregon)

I made my very first stained glass project and found that the foil is coming up on all of the edges. Can I just re-solder or do I have to redo it all again? I am not sure how to get the foil to "stick" now. Thanks.

Answer

It sounds like one of two problems. Either the edges of your glass were not clean before you applied the foil, or you didn't burnish the foil well enough after you applied it.

I use a paper towel dampened with alcohol to wipe the edges of each piece just before I foil. The alcohol cleans off any grinder residue and removes oily finger prints.

After the foil is in place use a fid, chopstick stick, small wall paper roller, or I've even been known to use the side of a ball point pen, to go around all of the edges of the foil to make sure it is pressed down very well. If it isn't pressed down well enough, flux can get under the foil and cause it to lift.

Once the foil has lifted, there isn't much hope of it sticking down again especially if flux has seeped under it. It's best to pull the foil off, clean the glass and start over.

Lifting Foil

by cyn polo
(carmel, Maine)

My foil is lifting after I solder, I have burnished very well, where the foil meets the glass is so smooth and it still lifts????I'm getting very frustrated.

Answer

You need to make sure the glass is absolutely clean before you apply the foil. After you cut and grind, wipe the edges with alcohol before you foil. The alcohol will clean the edges and it seems to make the foil stick better.

Also, if you read through the copper foil questions page you will find many questions (and answers) about the same or similar problems. There should be other answers that will help.

copper foiling

I am having trouble with the foil sticking after i am finished with my project. I clean with alcohol before sticking the foil, i use a ball point pin, burnish tool and have also tried the walpapper roller and taking special pains to make sure it is stuck good before fluxing and soldering but I am still getting lifting of the foil after i solder and wash my project.

Answer
Try a new roll of foil. If it sticks, then there is something wrong with the other roll. If you still have the same problem get back to me and I'll give you another solution.

Copper Foil Peeling Up

by Shirley
(Oklahoma)

I've noticed on 2 of my projects that a couple of places where the copper foil comes unadhered to the glass after I apply the flux. Am I putting on too much flux, or should I be using paste flux? I think I'm burnishing the foil well before soldering. I hope you can tell me what I'm doing wrong. Thanks!

Answer

You may not be cleaning the glass well enough before you apply the foil. If there is any grinder dust, oil from your cutter, or oil from you skin on the glass, the foil could lift after you solder it.

Even though you burnish very well, the foil isn't stuck down tightly. Flux gets under the foil, or water from cleaning gets under the foil and it lifts off the glass.

Try wiping each piece with a cloth dampened with alcohol before you foil it. The alcohol cleans the glass and it also seems to make the foil stick better. Don't use enough alcohol to make the glass wet, just enough that it cleans the glass and it evaporates by the time you start foiling.

The only other reason the foil could be lifting is that the foil is defective and has spots where there isn't any or very little adhesive. This is quite unlikely, but I have seen it happen. Check the roll of foil as you're using it, to see if that could be the problem.

Copper Foil Is Coming Loose

I do my foiling exactly as you have explained, but sometimes when I get my project complete the foil starts coming off. It is so very frustrating so I take the entire project apart and then redo it, and it happens again. It hasn't happened to everything I have done, so I don't understand what I am doing wrong.

Answer

It sounds like one of two problems. Either your glass isn't clean enough, or you haven't burnished the foil well enough.

Wipe every piece with alcohol before you foil it. Just put some alcohol on a paper towel and zip around the edges, making sure there is contact on all three surfaces. It only takes seconds, but makes a big difference in the way the foil sticks.

Secondly, if the foil isn't tight on the glass, flux and or water can get under it and cause it to lift. Make sure you go around the foil on both sides with your burnisher, pressing the foil down very well.

Another possibility is that you could have a defective roll offoil. It does happen occasionally. If it's only happening since you started using a particular roll of foil, that could be the problem.

Lastly, although this is the wrong time of the year, if you live in the northern hemisphere, foil sticks better to warm glass than cold glass.